Well, what can I say? Jeff Summers is just a top class musician and a real gentleman. This is my third interview with him and he has alway been very kind to me and provided full answers to my numerous questions (check out the interview about Wildfire, for example). This time I decided to try him out about the story of Weapon, on of the pioneers on NWOBHM, the band that along with Diamond Head, Blitzkrieg, Sweet Savage and some others influenced early Metallica. This interview was done almost 6 months ago, but due to infamous personal reasons I was unable to post it earlier.
Let's begin with a
boring as hell but still necessary question: how has your musical journey
begun? At what age did you pick up the guitar and what/who inspired you to do
so?
I bought a very inexpensive electric guitar
with money I had received for my 16th birthday. My 2 older brothers (Gary &
Steve) are guitarists and they inspired my interest in music. Prior to this I
had wanted to be a footballer but discovering Deep Purple through my brothers’
record collections changed all that. Within a year I was playing rudimentary
lead guitar and had formed a band with some of my school mates.
Before Weapon there
was Fast Relief. Who was in this band and was it a proper band that played gigs
and wrote original songs?
Yes, that's right. Fast Relief were initially called
Legs Akimbo and were the band formed at school with my mates. The band changed
its name to Flex and later Fast Relief when I met Kevin Ingles and asked him to
join the band. Yes, we gigged extensively around London and many other venues
in the South of England. After many line-up changes, we also completed a couple
of short tours of Wales . We were writing our own songs right from the start
and our set list consisted of about 80% original material written by myself,
Pete Armatage (bass player) and Kevin Ingles (guitar). The set included many
songs that became Weapon tracks including “Set the Stage Alight”.
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| Fast Relief |
Absolutely. The lyrics were exactly the same
except for the refrain which I changed to "Let's all together set the
stage alight" at the end of each chorus.
Who came up with the
name Weapon and a bit of an Iron Maiden-esque logo?
That was Danny's idea. We changed the name of
the band when Danny joined in 1980. The logo was designed by Kevin Ingles. Kev
was also a very talented graphic designer.
One of the early
versions of Weapon included three guys from a band called Flex: Lindsay
Broadbridge, Pete Armitage and Kevin Ingles. How did you meet them and why did
they quit the band? Did they make some input to the songwriting?
Yes, the line-up of Flex was Lindsay on drums,
Kevin on lead guitar, Pete on bass and lead vocals and me on lead guitar and
lead vocals. Pete and I did loads of vocal harmony stuff and Kev and I did
guitar harmonies, akin to Lizzy and Wishbone Ash.
Unfortunately, Kevin
died in 2020 of cancer, but what about others? Are you still friends with them?
Yes, Kevin's death hit us all hard. He was
always such a fit guy... I'm in touch with Pete, but rarely Lindsay. We all
have different lives now I guess!!
Danny auditioned for Fast Relief in 1980. We
had independently advertised for singer/band in the now defunct legendary music
paper Melody Maker. Danny brought Baz into the band to strengthen the rhythm
section which was deemed not powerful enough by Virgin Music publishing.
The single “Mad Mad World”/”Set the Stage Alight” was recorded with two producers: Simon Boswell and Richard Mainwaring. Where were these songs recorded? Who of the two producers understood your ideas better?
“Mad Mad World” was always considered to be the
single so Simon Biswell was brought in independently to ensure the song was
produced with commerciality in mind. ”Set the Stage Alight” was always a hard,
fast and heavy album track as far as Virgin were concerned. It was the bands
insistence that this release should be a double A side as we felt that ”Set the
Stage Alight” represented us better. Richard engineered and produced all of the
other tracks recorded at that time
Was the single a
self-financed thing or were you backed by Virgin Publishing?
It was all paid for from out advance from
Virgin Music publishing received after signing with them.
How come that you got
a publishing deal before a recording contract? And why didn’t Laurie Dunn, then
head of Virgin Publishing, use his connections to secure you a deal with Virgin
Records?
Bands and songwriters very often were offered
publishing deals before recording contracts in those days. Unfortunately,
Laurie left Virgin at the vital time for us and Virgin Records decided to sign
Gillan instead of us... I wonder why!!
Once you mentioned the
songs “No Peace for the Wicked” and “This is the Song that’s Gonna Help You
Along” that were never recorded. Did you use the riffs/melodies in some later
songs of Wildfire or Weapon?
Those 2 songs were written by myself and Pete
Armatage. Weapon demoed these and played them live and on tour. Incidentally,
the live recording of these tracks resurfaced recently from one of our shows at
the Hammersmith Odeon whilst on tour with Motorhead. Danny is releasing them on
vinyl at some point I believe.
In 1980 Fast Eddie
Clarcke saw one of your gigs and invited you to tour with Motorhead but you had
to play a showcase gig for Motorhead. What are your memories about the gig? Baz
once said that the band literally destroyed the place!
Drink I'm afraid... We were very young and
stupid in these days. We did in many ways. Baz and I smashed our guitars and
Danny was going at somebody with a snooker que!! Pretty crazy stuff! Drink,
testosterone and other substances were involved. We played a cracking show
though!!
During the “Ace up Yer
Sleeve” tour you played large venues like the Hammersmith Odeon. Was it easy to
learn how to entertain a few thousands of people after club gigs?
We were all very nervous. The venues were
packed with thousands of people wanting to see Motorhead. You very quickly
learn that you have to work very hard to win them over. We did on many
occasions.
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| On stage at Hannersmith Odeon |
I'm too young to remember the Odeon and from what I have read that was a venue with seats. How was it to play in front of a sitting audience?
Well fortunately, they didn't stay seated for
long. Opening with ”Set the Stage Alight” helped I'm sure. We played it even
faster live than we did on record!! Great days!
When I asked you about stories from that tour some years ago, you refused to share them. Now, when no one from that Motorhead’s line-up is alive and Lemmy can’t wring your neck (although I’m not certain about that), could you remember something interesting?
Everyday was an adventure. Lemmy, Phil and
Eddie were on the precipice of something historical and they were living life
to the full. As were we. Fights, rows, drink, fun, music and parties were everyday
occurrences of course, but most important for all of us were the shows. I nearly died when the bomber rigging fell
during soundcheck at one show. I was standing directly underneath it, literally
inches from death. I wouldn't like to comment on any other specifics in respect
to those fabulous generous lads from Motorhead (RIP).
In 1981 Weapon played
at the Marquee club twice. Now when the club is long gone, what are your
memories about the place? Who booked you there? Were the shows well attended?
If you remember how you got to the shows, who helped you unload the gear, how
long it took to pack everything after the shows etc. — that would be very
interesting to read!
Yes, I played the Marquee many times in the
80s. Weapon, Wildfire, Statetrooper all headlined the Marquee. I used to go to
the Marquee regularly as a teenager to see all the up and coming bands. AC/DC
and Queen included! Most of the gigs were booked through Jack Barry or Bush
Telfer who managed the Marquee at the time, but I wasn't involved in any of the
negotiations. It would've been management or record companies. I used to drive
to gigs either on my own or with (drummer) Bruce Bisland and we would load our
own kit into the gigs sometimes with the help of friends. We all helped each
other and always had fun laughing and joking whilst carrying the kit.
Yes, we played most of these venues along with
others like the Kensington Gardens, Nero’s Palace, the Brecknock and many
others that i can't remember. We played the Bandwagon but only once i think. I
also used to go there regularly as a punter. I met Neal Kay a couple of times
and he was always full of advice — some unwanted. He did a lot to promote the
cause of the NWOBHM though.
The song “ ‘79
Revisited” off the “Ghosts of War” album mentions the Ship in Wardour Street
and some Delilah. What are your best memories about the place and the woman?
The Ship was part of what became known as the
triangle on Wardour Street in London's Soho area. The Ship was literally about
20 meters away from the Marquee and was the meeting place for bands after
soundcheck at the Marquee. Fans got to realise this and would have a drink in
the Ship before moving on to watch the show at the Marquee sitting down and
chatting with the musicians who were chilling out before showtime. We spent
many a happy hour in the Ship whether playing there or just hanging out with
other musicians. Delilah? Not sure about her... Danny wrote the verse lyrics to
“ ‘79 Revisited” so would be best if you asked him. By the way, when
Statetrooper played the Marquee, the band had retired to the Ship after
soundcheck as usual. Our manager Dave Chapman came to get us out of the pub and
on stage as we were running late. As we left the pub, we realised there was a
huge queue going down Wardour Street and that this would hold us up getting in
to the gig and on stage in time. We were quickly informed that this was a queue
of people trying to get in to see us.
Was there camaraderie among London bands or were you all more or less on your own?
A bit of both really. We all knew of each other
and would go to each other’s gigs if we were not performing ourselves.
Yes, we turned up at the first venue on that
tour and were told we had been double booked!! Management had screwed it up! We
were pretty upset and decided to spend our "float" (subsistence)
money on getting drunk and eating a curry as a show of defiance to our
management company. Bruce got very drunk and ended up face planting in his
curry. We were then asked to leave the restaurant and protested this treatment.
As we walked out of the door, we saw Bruce standing on the bonnet of a very
expensive car whilst urinating on its windscreen. He must have known that the
car belonged to the owner of the restaurant.
Is it true that you
had to buy out your contract with Virgin Publishing? If yes, I guess it cost
you a fortune. Where did you find such an amount of money?
No, that isn't correct. We never had the money
to buy out our contract.
At what point Bob
“Angelo” Sawyer and Ron “Rebel” Matthews joined the band? How was it to play
with a second guitarist?
Bob and Ron joined separately. Bob in 1981 when
I was in the band and Ron around 1982 I think, when I had joined Wildfire. I
loved playing with Bob. He's a great player and a seriously funny guy.
I heard that during
the final tour something happened at the Granary, Bristol. Any memories about
that?
We broke the attendance record at the Granary.
This record was previously held by the prog rock band YES.
Both you and Dany
blamed the management for the band’s failure. Could you comment on that please?
What did you expect from the management and what did they do wrong in your
opinion?
They had little or no experience in managing a
rock band. They had been appointed by Virgin Music and although were lovely
fellows were completely out of their depth.
After Weapon you
played with Wildfire and Statetrooper. Have you ever been approached by some
other established bands for a possible job?
That's correct. I have been approached by many
bands over the years, but was either already in a band or didn't feel that the
offer was right for me.
Lars Ulrich and James
Hetfield have always said how much they loved Weapon in the early 80’s. They
invited some of their heroes like Brian Tattler or Ray Haller to play “Am I
Evil?” and “Killing Time”. Have you ever been asked to join Metallica on stage?
What’s your opinion
about Zoom Club Records who released your compilation “Set the Stage Alight’?
Some bands complained that this label released albums without any promotion.
I don't really have an opinion. I thought that
the packaging and re-master work they did was really good. I was working on a
new Statetroooer album (“The Calling”) at the time and didn't really keep tabs
on any marketing.
The compilation
included 4 previously unreleased tracks. When and where were they recorded and
how come that they were unmastered?
The four tracks were: "Remote
Control," "Killer Instinct"
"Light of the World" and "The Things You Do" and
were recorded at Alric Studios in London during 1981. They were just demos as
ideas, were recorded in a hurry and were hopefully going to be master recorded
once we had signed a full record deal. The band split up shortly after so
unfortunately this never happened.
It took you quite a
few years to reunite after the release of the compilation and play some live
shows in 2005. Was it because of the unavailability of Baz and Bruce?
Not really, Baz and Bruce would've made
themselves available had we known that the band were still in demand. Baz
wasn't well by this time, and Bruce and I were busy with Sweet and the new
Statetrooper album "The Calling". Statetrooper had been offered gigs
and festival work which we did and also had a record deal with Toshiba EMI so
we were tied up with all of this. We became aware that interest in Weapon
playing live again were circulating and I think the Zoom Club reissue helped
with awareness of the bands legacy. We played the Headbangers Open Air festival
in Germany during 2005 and realised that the band was still fondly remembered.
At this stage we started playing other live work and decided to start working
on a new album. However Baz and Bruce could not be involved because of Baz's
illness and Bruce's commitments with the Sweet.
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| Backstage at Headbangers Open Air Festival |
The album “Rising up from the Ashes” was ready in 2012 but it was postponed due to a legal battle over the name with some Canadian death metal band. How come that you didn’t register the copyright years ago? Another failure of Smart Management who managed the band in the 80’s?
“Rising from the Ashes" took a while to
record. Finding the right people to replace Bruce and Baz was not easy both
emotionally and musically. Re-registering the name never occurred to us until
these totally dishonest (and believe me they were) Canadian death metal band
monitored the copyright and stole it from under our noses. We were far too
trusting of them. Nasty, nasty people!!
Was there any chance
to buy out the copyright or were the Canadians stubborn? Did you consider an
option to keep the name, especially after the Canadians broke-up in 2013?
They were threatening to sue us if we used OUR
name and had sent a cease and desist notice. They had a very good lawyer and we
were not in a financial position to fight a long and expensive court case that
we knew we would lose. Danny now holds the rights to the name Weapon and Weapon
UK I believe.
Due to this situation you lost the deal with management and the label (if I am correct). What was the problem? Didn’t they want to spend money on lawyers? Are you able to reveal the name of the management company?
That particular management company turned out
to be corrupt and strung us out with promises they had no intention of keeping.
I can't name the individual involved but sincerely wish i could
You told me that the
original plan was to call the album “Bulletproof” but I guess “Rising from the
Ashes” suited better after all these issues. What helped you to keep the band
going after such disheartening circumstances?
Correct!! "Bulletproof" seemed
appropriate at the time considering all the legal and management issues we were
experiencing. The love of our music and playing together kept us going through
all of this non music related crap!! Musicians are like that. The music always
comes first.
“Rising…” included a
re-recorded version of “Killer Instinct” with Baz Downes and Bruce Bisland. How
was it possible as Baz was very ill at the time? And why did you pick up this
particular track?
Although Baz was very ill at the time, he could
still play very well and recording in the studio was still within his
capabilities at the time too. He did his parts in one take and I picked him up
and drove him to and from the studio on the day, so this wasn’t too exhausting
for him. He did a great job and really enjoyed himself. "Killer
Instinct" was chosen by Danny.
It just happened that way. Nothing that we ever
produced was ever contrived. We never had a formula. It was whatever came
naturally to us at the time. Our
influences and musical ambitions have always been extensive and eclectic so we
have never thought in terms of how heavy or fast an album would be. I think
songs like "Ghosts of War", “Sea of Hope" and
"Tourniquet" are pretty heavy though...
In 2021 the band
started recording a new album called “Forewarned is Forearmed” and you left in
the middle of the process due to personal reasons. Did you write and record
anything for the album?
I wrote a complete set of songs for another
Weapon album, but in truth my heart wasn't in it anymore. I had decided that i
didn't want to go through the process again and live promotion work was
becoming increasingly difficult. All the band members were living in different
countries and the logistics were weighing me down.
Some years ago you
played with Mick Underwood. How did you get in touch with him? How Mick is
doing these days?
I was playing a pub gig with my covers band the
Loudshirts and Mick was in the audience. He came up to me afterwards and asked
if my brother Gary (bass player in the band) and I would be interested in
having a jam with him. Consequently we spent about 5 very happy years playing
with this brilliant drummer around the UK. "Glory Road" was a
fantastic experience and it was such a joy to play those brilliant songs! Mick
is well as far as I know..
Do you have any desire
to start a new band and record new music?
Of course. I always do. I have lots of songs ready to go. Just watch this space.
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