Reincarnate: Metal in disguise

“Staffordshire’s outstanding Reincarnate were unquestionable one of the comparatively few British outfits who genuinely epitomised the term NWOBHM in its purest and original sense” — these words are taken from Malc Macmillan’s “NWOBHM Encyclopedia” and if you have read it you know that such kind words are rare to find on pages of the book! I guess many of you are already familiar with their legacy (a demo and a single) but if you are not and still have some doubts the name Paul “Fazza” Farrington of Demon’s and Harrier’s fame should convince you to check them out! So take a seat, turn on the music louder and have a good read with Dave Tye (drums) and Paul Farrington (bass).  

Tell me, please, how you got in touch with the guys from Reincarnate. Were you still in school back then? Who came up with the idea of forming the band?

Dave: I was in High School. I remember seeing an ad in a local newspaper. I was terrified. These two guys I met were older than me. John and Steve. They had really loud gear. They sounded like Judas Priest. I loved it! So I had to learn to play louder and harder to keep up. They made me feel very comfortable and I became part of the band basically immediately. We didn’t have bass and vocals initially, so it was great to later add Paul, who my friends brother and Shane on vocals.

Paul: My old school mate Dave Tye gave me a shout about these guys he was rehearing with calling themselves Reincarnate. I was about 17 or 18 I think! They needed a bass player. I’d never played Bass guitar, just keyboards. So I decided to buy myself a Bass and a rig and learned the set before going along to the audition. I remember doing this in a matter of about a week. I got the position as Bass player!

Who suggested the name Reincarnate? Did you consider any other names?

Dave: I don’t remember to be honest. But we did have a lot of dark songs, so I guess it was appropriate.

Paul: I don’t know much about this as I recall the band already calling themselves Reincarnate at the time I joined.

As far as I understand, Steve Birchall was in the original line-up. When and why did he leave the band? Why didn’t you replace him but decided to go on as a four-piece?

Dave: I always liked Steve. Still do. Funny, talented bloke. I don’t specifically remember what happened, but one day he just stated he was leaving. I can only guess that it was a clash with John. They were both very talented guys with strong personalities. I’d like to think we couldn’t replace him because he was part of the band. So we just carried on.

Paul: I really can’t remember why Steve moved on! You’ll catch him on Facebook, I’m sure he’ll recall what happened. We did try to replace him. I can remember holding auditions and also remember that nobody was suitable. We decided to continue as a four piece. We even experimented at rehearsals with me playing keyboards along with Bass pedals but we never took that idea out on the road.

The line-up with Steve Birchall (in the centre)

Stoke-On-Trent is the native city for punk/hardcore bands Broken Bones and Discharge. So what were your relationships with them? Did you ever played with them? Wasn’t there an animosity between punks and metalheads?

Dave: We used to rehearse in the same studios as those most of those guys in Stoke. We only really interacted with them in the pub next door, where you would see rockers and punks having a pint together after a rehearsal. There was never any issues. They had pointy hair, we had greasy long hair.

Paul: I don’t recall any problems like that on the music scene at the time… Each genre kept itself to itself. Only one time when we were booked to play at a venue which was a punk venue (which we weren’t aware of at the time) was there trouble… quite a good fight as I recall! Reincarnate shared a rehearsal room (an old warehouse room) with a couple of bands. They all played various genres including punk and we got on very well. Being a musician was what we all had in common!

On the other hand, there were bands like Le Griffe, Predator and Expozer. Were you friends with them? Were there any kind of a metal community in the town which supported heavy metal?

Dave: There was so much talent in Stoke. Still is! I am amazed that we didn’t get more recognition. I blame the lazy managers and labels who couldn’t get past Birmingham. Later on, they went to Manchester to sign bands. They by-passed Stoke on the way. Those guys in those bands were of course our competitors, but we always got along. After all these years, I still see them when I go back to Stoke. Usually hang out at the rock club “Eleven” where all the old rockers end up.

Paul: Yes, we knew these bands very well! Since moving on from Reincarnate I have played with some of the old members of these bands. We all went out and watched each other regularly. There were many venues around Stoke at that time, many were Rock pubs/venues. Yes there was a large heavy rock/metal community in Stoke.

I guess that the most popular band from your area was Demon. Did you foresee such a success this band gained in the early 80’s?

Dave: I was good friends with a local Stoke legend named The Legendary Lonnie (Cook) . A wonderful person, character and folk/pop player who had some success with “Wine Glass Rock”. He’s still going strong today I’m told. He was a bit of a music mentor for me. I would go around to his house in Hartshill in Stoke and see his extensive vinyl collection. One day he told me (out of the blue) that he had contributed to a single in band that they threw together. It was him, Les Hunt (who we knew of course) Chris Ellis, who I knew from local radio or newspaper and a couple of others. We were all working really hard with all the other bands you mentioned and were getting quite well known. Apparently, someone from a local record company (Clay) had decided to put a commercial rock single out. Lonnie gave me a signed copy of the single. I played it. It was OK. But I always thought it was quite contrived.  I always felt that they should have chosen a local band to push, but I guess that commercialism won. None of the bands you mention were supported by local or national record companies. Everyone else was self funded...except the Demon stuff. It is a little annoying that the real bands didn’t make it, but the contrived one did.

Paul: I have to say that I didn’t see Demon in those days. They were already further up the ladder than the rest of the metal bands in Stoke and so they didn’t really play locally that often…they were away playing in Europe. I played with them myself for around nine years..played on a couple of albums and produced a live DVD of one of the German shows.

Tell me please about the clubs in Stoke. Were they supportive to bands who played original stuff? Can you recall any Spinal Tap moments in the band’s history?

Dave: There were a few good venues. The best being “The Waggon” and “Horses in Meir”. Great location. Great support. Great bands. Our first gig was at a youth club in Stoke. I’ll never forget it. It was surreal. Big booming sound in a gymnasium type room and a bunch of greasy, long hairs singing songs about death and destruction! We used to contact pubs and clubs around the Stoke area and beg them to have a band play. Paul was really good at this. A couple of them accepted. The best one was a guy in Telford who had a pub called the Ironmaster. We contacted him and he agreed to put us on. It was a great night and he eventually had a few Stoke bands play. It became really cool venue.

Paul: Many bands did play original material. Reincarnate mixed original and cover material when performing. Yes, the stoke venues and audience were quite supportive of original material. Spinal Tap moments… I know there must have been but it’s a long time ago! I do recall Steve reversing the van up outside a venue. He was hanging out of the door (it was a slide door). I was watching our pathway from the passenger seat. I briefly looked back in the vehicle to make some comment to Steve but he wasn’t there! He’d fallen out of the van!

Tell me everything you can recall about recording the first demo. When and where was it recorded? Was it an easy process? What was the purpose of the demo? Did you use it only to get more gigs or did you sent it to labels?

Dave: The first demo was recorded at a studio somewhere that I don’t recall. But the stuff we did at BBC Radio Stoke in Hanley was something I recall. I think it was four songs. I remember Les Hunt was producing the songs for the BBC who were covering local music. It wasn’t a real recording studio. It was set up as a radio station, so it didn’t sound too good. It was cramped and we were rushed. It was basically recorded live. A little over dubbing, but not much.

Paul: I think our first demo was recorded at a place near to Market Drayton called Strawberry Studios. I think we did four tracks. Yes, we did send them off to labels and venues but unfortunately didn’t hear back from the labels. The demo did help us to secure other gigs further afield at more established venues. I must try and find that demo, I don’t know if I still have it!

Who composed those four tracks off the demo and what was the band’s songwriting method back then?

Dave: John and Steve were the songwriters. They were more worldly-wise and older than me and knew more about life. I still lived at home. I was only 15 or 16, they were married and lived as adults. What the hell did I know about life at that point? 

Paul: Steve and John wrote all the material separately. All music, melodies and lyrics! Either one would simply turn up at a rehearsal and show us what to play/sing. Any twin guitar lines would then be worked out (but usually each writer had already worked on them before hand)

The single “Take It Or Leave It” showed band’s progress both in songwriting and sound production. Was it all up to Lester Hunt who produced the single or did you learn a lot from your previous studio session and live shows?

Dave: I really think we were going in the right direction. Live shows were great. We were cutting our teeth in local clubs and pubs. The single felt like we were on our way. It was very exciting times.

Paul: I think it was mainly down to Les (an original Demon member, now playing with The Climax Blues band). Our recording and studio experience was very limited. In those days you had to record at a studio and that cost bands money. So, it wasn’t a regular occurrence and Les was only too happy to steer us along.

Did you try to use this connection to Demon to push the band forward? Wasn’t Demon’s management interested in working with Reincarnate?

Dave: No not at all. Like I said, Demon were contrived apparently. Lonnie didn’t last long and Les and Chris were gone soon after. They had some good stuff later. Steve Watts was a friend of mine from School. Great keyboard player. I think he did some great stuff with them. Ironically, Paul Farrington, who was the bass player in Reincarnate, ended up playing with Demon for a few years on the keyboards. I am also very good friends with Paul and Neil from the current line-up, who were also in local bands. As I said, they were a made up band initially…. “The Monkees of Metal” in Stoke.

Paul: I’d already sent off our original demo to Clay records who were handling Demon but we never heard back from them (Mike Stone). By the time we recorded Take it or leave it Les had moved on from Demon and so there wasn’t really any concrete connection to work at or push forward.

How did you get the deal with Zipp? Did you consider it as a stepping stone and were happy to get some product in your hands? 

Dave: It was really just a decent demo. Zipp Records was the name of the label we used that was associated with the recording studio. We financed the whole thing. I remember us send the ¼” reel out to France I think it was to be cut. We made 500 copies and sent them everywhere. Not too many ended up on people’s record decks. If you find one, they’re quite valuable now I’m told. Apparently we were big in Japan...but isn’t everyone?

Paul: Again, I think that Zipp were just starting out and as much as we wanted/needed a deal, they needed bands out on their label. It was a two way arrangement..not contractually though, that helped both parties. So yes, a bit of a stepping stone in that manner.

What happened to the band when the single came out? Did you keep on touring? Did you get a chance to support any popular band by the way?

Dave: Not really. Just kept playing and pushing the band. We had no representation. No management or record company would touch us. It was very frustrating.

Paul: We sent the single out everywhere! Record companies, venues and radio stations. Again, it helped to get more gigs but it was so difficult to get a foot through the door elsewhere! We’ve had more interest from that single in the last 15 years than we did back when we recorded it! We did continue to gig. We also did a session for BBC radio Stoke but things weren’t moving forward very well and we didn’t get an opportunity to support any bigger bands. We really needed help from somebody in the business. We needed music management. There wasn’t anything like that in Stoke!

When and why did the band split-up?

Dave: I think Shane was a little upset about something, then I recall John came in and said he had family stuff he had to take care of. He was older, married and had kids. That was that. We move onward and upward.

Paul: As I’ve mentioned, things weren’t moving forwards. Then our singer failed to turn up for a rehearsal. After that it became apparent that the band were crumbling. We did a gig or two with a stand in vocalist but it wasn’t to last. We’d gone as far as we could!

Dave Tye

Dave, tell me about your life after Reincarnate. What have you done musically since then?

Dave: So I joined some guys from other local bands (the one’s you mentioned earlier) and formed Mad Hatter. We did quite well.  We moved to London. Got a development deal with Warner Bros. We were in “Kerrang!” magazine. We attended and jammed at a 100th “Kerrang!” edition party. Then that band fizzled over time after various member changes. Paul Hume from Mad Hatter went on to bigger things with a great band called Lawless. He still plays with Demon occasionally also. So I moved to the States. I live in California now. Different music scene here. The Hollywood vibe in a bit glammy compared to the fribby feel of English rock. I now play with Rik Fox from Steeler (Malmsteen), WASP and Shane Hunter from the Pete Way band in a Montrose type band. Lots of fun for an older rocker.

Paul (second on from the right) with Harrier

Paul, in 1984 you went on to play keyboards with Harrier. Tell me about that band please. Did you relocate to London to be closer to the magazines, labels etc.? What are your best memories about that period of your life?

Paul: I had a call from this band shortly after Reincarnate’s demise. They were also playing a mix of original and cover material. We played similar venues and also bike rallies around the midlands. Before I joined they’d also played over in Germany. We went on to record an EP at AVM studios in Stoke which Les hunt had going with a couple of other guys, Des Parton and Barry Cartlidge. He’d transformed Zipp into AVM and along with Des worked with us on this recording. We had good radio air play and gigged regularly. Often being out for days at a time. This was great fun for me. At that time I loved being out all the time… music, women and alcohol! However, like Reincarnate we needed credible music management and like Reincarnate I came to a point where I felt the band couldn’t go any further.

Tell me, please, about your musical achievements after Harrier. Did you record anything with any bands?

Paul: I had a call from Dave Tye about a band he was playing with called Mad Hatter and they needed a replacement bass player. They were looking at moving to London and getting management and recording contracts. I left Harrier to join these guys. We never recorded vinyl but did some demo’s for Warner Brothers… again at AVM with Les and Des. We moved to London and secured a manager but again it was very difficult to get a foot through the door of the recording companies! We played regularly around London and also did a little European tour as well as playing at one of “Kerrang!”s parties filmed by MTV.

Paul (third from the left) with Demon

How did you get the gig with Demon? Why did the band record only two albums in seven years? Why did you quit the band eventually?

Paul: I got a call from Demon’s drummer Neil Ogden. They were planning on moving things on a little, playing some European festivals and some tours too. They were half way through recording “Better the Devil You Know!”. It was just what I needed! However, moving forward was slower than I’d expected and there’d be months when the band were inactive. They’d taken the foot off the pedal a little before I joined and even at their level it’s not always easy get that door open again! Eventually things seemed to be picking up and there was interest and demand for Demon. They continue to this day! Things became awkward during the final stages of recording “Unbroken”. The management decided to take on the role of mixing and finalizing the album. It became apparent that this was a huge mistake and I felt it was unacceptable for this to happen and decided to leave before it was even pressed!

And again, what have you done musically since 2012? Do you keep on playing music?

Paul: I still play regularly in bands and an acoustic duo. In fact I’ve never not being playing music on the circuit since I first joined Reincarnate! I am currently just starting out with a John Sykes tribute band called Syked playing songs by Whitesnake, Thin lizzy and Blue Murder. We have shows booked all over the uk for next year, it’s just beginning to get established.

Do you still stay in touch with other guys from Reincarnate?

Dave: Yep. I spoke to Shane, Paul, Steve and John last year about doing a gig when I come over to England. It was really close to happening, but we just couldn’t get everyone together logistically. They were all receptive to it, but just missed a couple of windows. I’m hoping to try again soon and do something for a one night special.

Paul: I did a Mad Hatter reunion gig with Dave Tye a couple of years ago and Harrier also did one back in 2012 i think! The singer with Reincarnate is my ex brother in law and so we do touch base on rare occasions.

Have you ever heard that Reincarnate influenced any well known musician or something like that? What is the place of the band in the music history in your opinion?

Dave: Local Stoke history for sure. Sometimes you just need that break. We were a great band but inexperienced, young, shitty business people, and the example I gave shows that it’s not always about the music. The business is just as influential unfortunately. I live in the real world, so no hard feelings. It is what it is….cheers.

Paul: Ha! that’s a nice little thought! However, I’m not aware that this has happened. I don’t really think that we were established enough or were heard enough. But you never know! I liked the band’s sound. Steve and John used the same guitar amps, “Phoenix” I think. The sound was smooth and rich and very distinct. The twin solos/harmonies were just woven together. That could have had an influence had we been more established. There wasn’t a sound conflict between the two guitars, a little like early Thin Lizzy. Reincarnate was my gateway to a career in music. I’ve had some great, great times and met some great people. So to me Reincarnate holds a special place in musical history… my musical history!